APO players’ rehearsal and practice wiki

The APO players’ practice and rehearsal wiki captures information from rehearsals, to help any players who couldn’t make a given session, or to help those who were there remember what happened! The source of that information is YOU – the APO players. Send us your observations on Facebook, Twitter, email, the comments box below, or use the white sheets at rehearsals, and Andrew will transcribe it onto this page for everyone to see.

Practice tempi for The Planets


  • Allegro – crotchet = 132 (and thus the minim speed in the 5/2 section is 64)


  • Adagio – crotchet = 60-70
  • Andante – 80-90
  • Largo – 50-60


  • Dotted minim = 72 (probably easier to set your metronome to dotted crotchet = 144, for practice)


  • Allegro giocoso – crotchet = 120
  • Figure V – crotchet = 160-170 (not as fast as you think and I’ll probably hold it a little bit back from this, but good for practice!)
  • Piu mosso (which we reach via the stringendo) – crotchet = 180-190 (beat in 1 – dotted minim = 60)
  • Andante maestoso – crotchet = 84
  • Tempo 1 at X will probably be a little faster than the beginning (132 or so) before returning to the opening 120 at the Maestoso
  • XV – more like the 180 immediately it’s meant to be the first time (cos there’s no accelerando to worry about, this time round!)
  • (Lento Maestoso is the same beat as the 1 in a bar (60) before it.)
  • Presto – a very exciting minim (1 in a bar) = 96!


  • Adagio – crotchet = 74
  • Poco animato – crotchet = 86
  • Animato sections and Andante from V – crotchet = 90 (minim = 45)


  • Allegro – dotted minim = 112
  • Largo (worth practising for breathing and sustaining the sound!) – crotchet = 58


  • Andante – crotchet = 84
  • Allegretto – crotchet = 96

15 thoughts on “APO players’ rehearsal and practice wiki

  • September 29, 2018 at 1:32 pm

    My score arrived today (Dover miniature edition). Disappointingly it has no bar numbers so I have been copying them in from the Universal Edn on IMSLP. In the process it is obvious that the Dover edition has lots of mistakes*.

    One that jumped out is that Mahler’s later addition of the bass clarinet to bolster the bassoon sound in the 3 bars before 10 (Mvt 1) is missing in our parts/Dover score, which is why perhaps I can hear it in recordings but not in rehearsal!

    Mahler’s own score with his markings is available online here: http://curiosity.lib.harvard.edu/scores/catalog/8-002402630 (see page 14).

    * mistakes in the sense that Mahler changed things later. Given that he was still fixing Beethoven when he conducted hi, it seems a safe bet that there would be many more changes if he were to hear it today. And indeed he did say to conductors that they shouldn’t draw back from changing things after he had died. A living rather than a definitive score!

    • September 30, 2018 at 10:11 am

      Ah, thanks, Charlie! I wondered why Emily looked a bit puzzled when I referred to that bit, during rehearsals. I’ll drop her a note.

      • September 30, 2018 at 8:04 pm

        Ahh sorry if that went totally over my head in rehearsals! I only have a bassoon cue 3 before 10 – do you want it?

        • September 30, 2018 at 8:07 pm

          You’d have done bloody well to spot it! Yes, please. I have a photo of the notes if the bassoon cue is not clear enough. Sorry to add more semiquavers to your part. 😀

  • September 30, 2018 at 9:07 pm

    Haha that’s fine, I’ll have a good look at it tomorrow

  • October 2, 2018 at 7:30 pm

    Bar before fig.8 in the 1st movement: do you have some of the horns playing in that bar? The score I downloaded from IMSLP has only the trumpets with quintuplets at that point (bar rest for all horns).

    • October 7, 2018 at 6:41 am

      Nope – no horns in my score. Am I looking at you hopefully there, then? 😀

  • October 7, 2018 at 6:51 am

    Capturing some notes from a white sheet (from a member of the woodwind) quickly in a comment, so they can be transferred upwards into the main notes, later (my comments in brackets). Really useful to know what players feel needs work, especially just ahead of sectionals!

    Movement 1
    – 5th bar of Figure 4, tuning needs work (I agree, though it can be quite nasty and even a little bit out of tune for effect – it’s that sort of writing)
    – Figure 27, tuning and balance needs work (and I’d add to that ensemble, at Figure 50, too)
    – 5 before Figure 72 – piano! (YES!)
    – Figure 74 – swirly thing, together. (I’m not so concerned about this, as long as it’s not before where it’s meant to be (as that’ll mean we can’t hear the harps’ gliss.))

    Movement 2
    – Dovetailing of material between Figures 5 and 6 needs work (agreed!)

    Movement 6
    – Tuning at the end, especially during dims. (yes – a big challenge, especially the comma before Figure 31!)

    All the quiets *quieter*! (I’m not sure this is necessarily a problem in general – I’d always rather wind soloists played up and were heard, but will ask Robert to work on balance during this morning’s sectional.)

  • October 11, 2018 at 1:46 pm

    Hello! A white sheet was handed in to me from 2nd violins (thanks Chico and Karen!), plus notes I’ve made, combined and listed below. Cheryl also helpfully sent me a link to a webpage of Mahler translations – if you plan on playing other Mahler symphonies it might be helpful to bookmark! http://www.orchestralibrary.com/reftables/mahler2gloss.html

    First movement
    – At the start, most trem entries for 1sts and 2nds (and sometimes vlas) have upbeats either from the crazy cello scales, or the trumpet fanfares, so we need to be aware of these and wait for the downbeat not come in with the upbeat. Examples:
    * 1sts entry 5th of fig.3 has upbeat from trumpet (the triplet fanfare Da-Da-Da-DAAAAA bit!)
    * 1sts & 2nds fig.6 has upbeat from trumpet (same as above)
    * 1sts & 2nds 7th of fig.6 has upbeat from cellos (crazy scale)
    * 2nds & vlas 4 before fig.7 has upbeat from cellos (crazy scale)
    * 2nds fig.7 has upbeat from both cellos (crazy scale) and trumpet (fanfare)
    * 1sts 5th of fig.7 has upbeat from both cellos (scale) and trumpet (fanfare)
    * 1sts & 2nds 6th of fig.8 has upbeat from cellos (scale)
    * Vlas 4 before fig.9 has upbeat from cellos (scale)
    * 1sts & 2nds fig.9 upbeat from trumpet (fanfare)

    – 10 before fig.5 for 1sts and 2nds – Andrew mentioned in rehearsal and in the wiki he is beating this in 3 (triplet minims). In case it’s not clear from the part, we come in on his 3rd beat with our own crazy scale.
    – In 2 at 8 bars before fig.7
    – In 4 at 11th bar of fig.10
    – In 2 at fig.29
    – In 4 at approx 5 before fig.34
    – The print in the 1sts and 2nds part misses the slur the bar before fig.45
    – 1sts and 2nds – entry after fig.50, in Chico’s words which I fully support, is ‘mental – totally practice this bit!’
    – Fig.74 the first note is a single quaver, not trem.
    – Fig.75 first violins isn’t scrubbed despite your leader often mistakenly doing this… sorry!

    Second movement
    – strings in our graceful melodies, leave the semiquavers (eg at the end of dotted rhythms) later, especially when followed by triplet quavers to really make the difference in rhythms. Andrew suggested thinking of them almost as a grace note.
    – Fig.10 sense of moving forward from here
    – Fig.12 1sts and 2nds have an insanely quick mute on and off fiasco (and violas too?). Suggest leave the mute out, especially as 2nds and violas have an important line here. (1sts just have to keep it down!)
    – Fig.16 is a bit rubato, then back in time at the 3rd bar.
    – Fig.17 1sts it’s difficult and needs avid watching for the tempo, so it’s high on my practice list to get to know better so I’m not fixated on the notes instead of the beat!

    Third movement
    – In the flugelhorn sections, where the strings have crazy divisi instructions, anyone who has a moving inner line needs to be heard (1sts I’ll be changing the divisi here to address the balance)

    Fourth movement
    /—–3—–\ __ __
    | | | | | | |
    O O O O O O O
    Three crotchet triplets, two pairs of quavers, in the septuplet bars. Andrew will beat 3 crotchet triplets followed by 2 crotchets. That was way too much fun to draw, surely I must have other things to do!

    – 4th bar of fig.3 has 2 pauses and a rit, followed by a tempo in 4th bar of fig.3. Not all parts have this marked in (eg 1sts just have a block of rests) so worth noting to help count.

    Sixth movement
    – 2nds (and other strings?) morendo fig.11/12?
    – Don’t forget the big comma/pause before fig.31

  • January 19, 2019 at 9:14 pm

    Debussy, Four before figure 2, you mentioned dropping to p next bar – does this mean us too? (Looks like continuous crescendo in our parts)

    • January 19, 2019 at 9:58 pm

      Did I? That’s strange. I think I was probably talking about the crescendo in the previous bar from the oboe, clarinet and bassoons that goes all the way up to the barline, then falls back to piano in the fourth bar before 2.

  • January 27, 2019 at 8:52 am

    Debussy, bar before 10: My score has pizz for the 1st violins and inside violas (four semiquavers), based on a handwritten correction by Debussy in the proofs. Shall we do that?

    • January 27, 2019 at 9:11 am

      Let’s check my score, later!

  • January 28, 2019 at 6:47 pm

    Bacchanale: ref your point about the last bar which mentions wind and brass. Do you want perc (most noticably cyms & BD) to play on this 2nd beat also (instead of the written 1st beat)?

    • February 1, 2019 at 9:52 am

      Yes please!


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